Tuesday, June 1, 2010

BLOG FIGHT!! RiPPa "The Memphis Mauler" vs Freeman "The Compton Crusader"


Unwilling to sit next to my older brothers, who in their excitement had the propensity to use me as a punching bag, I chose the comfort of sitting close to my father. My mother was there, it was the Gillette Friday Night Fights. I vividly remember those days back in our 8' X 10' living room. Financially poor but rich in love, we nestled together, using our laps to balance the sweet kool-aid and lunch meat sandwiches that mom prepared for us.
We didn't have a phone to break the excitement in the air. Back in those days we didn't need a phone on Friday nights, all we needed was our father to guide us through the gentleman's sport of pugilism.

Dad had a keen knack of picking the victorious fighter. He said the man with the coolest head would prevail. Back then, I was guilty of thinking the guy with the largest muscles and the loudest mouth would certainly be the victor.

Sitting in his favorite sagging chair, complete with a quilt that mom had sewn together, my father dispensed words of wisdom on the finer points of battle. Knowledge, preparation and class were the words he frequently championed. My father was a quiet man, he was never a big talker. He seldom gave his opinion unless it was ask for, yet, he was a boxer, a Golden Glove Champ.

I miss my father. One of the last fights we saw together was the battle between the great Muhammad Ali and Larry Holmes. It was a sad night because Ali lost. Larry Holmes was an up and coming fighter. For nearly 9 years he held the title of Heavyweight Champion Of The World. He once was a sparing partner of Ali. He learned his craft through Ali.

Pinned on the ropes in the later rounds, Ali was a beaten man. Although he was known as the Louisville Lip for his taunting of other fighters, Ali was very quiet at this juncture in the fight, yet, his ego wouldn't let him go down. When Larry Holmes realized that Ali could no longer defend himself, he gestured to the referee to stop the fight. With class, respect, and a sense of purpose, Mr. Holmes tempered his onslaught.

A debate is much like a boxing match. In a debate all the slippery moves of a pugilistic battle are used to trump the attack of an opponent. I have two friends that I give the ultimate respect. They have been going through a few things. I did a post on the art of debating http://careycarey-carrymehome.blogspot.com/2009/09/gong-show-blog-style-some-debators.html , they stepped in the ring.

Fast and furious, they debated in the background. At times I thought I heard Delray Lindo's famous line from Cider House Rules, "What business are you in, boy!". Yep, the razors came out. There's other links to their epic battle in the comment section. Today it's not about who won that battle, you can be the judge of that. Today it's about this......

"The ultimate measure of a man in not where he stands in moments of comfort and convenience, but where he stands at times of challenge and controversy" -- Martin Luther King Jr.

See, RiPPa and Freeman are both good men. Although they have their differences, I know they respect each other for what they do, or they wouldn't have spent the time to engage each other. I heard it said that if a person spends to much time talking to a fool, there will soon be 2 fools talking. Well, neither of these men are anybodies fools.

RiPPa's http://rippdemup.blogspot.com/ pointed commentary has been defined by some as controversial. But that's right in RiPPa's wheel-house.

"I'd like to meet people as warped in the head as I am. Free thinkers who aren't afraid to question everything" -- RiPPa
Some of Freeman's http://freemanpress.wordpress.com/2009/08/28/freeman-on-riseandgrind-com/ visitors have called him a radical. I don't know what they mean by that, but Freeman has said he believes in building and not begging.

Today is a good day. Both brothas are off doing their thang, and I know they are doing it well. Dr. King could have had them in mind when he wrote this:
"Rarely do we find men who willingly engage in hard, solid thinking. There's an almost universal quest for easy answers and half-baked solutions. Nothing pains some people more than having to think"
Don't get me wrong. They both can cuss with the best of them. They will cut someone at their kneecaps, and watch them bleed - if they have to! But today I'm looking for the messages beneath the madness. I'm left to wonder if they delivered their true messages, or did their emotions get the best of them? Did they evade the truth while clouding the issues? Please, you be the judge of that and come back and holler. I'm sure they will be back. RiPPa said don't be afraid to say what's on your mind. Freeman is always looking for a better way. Please hurry before another fight breaks out. Black men with big egos is a dangerous thang.
RiPPa said...
Oh lord... now you the blog po-po!LOLI love a good debate. And it's not my fault that some people cannot properly articulate their positions.


CareyCarey said...
Yep RiPPa, I's be the babies daddy.when I first started blogging, you mentioned something about having discomfort or concerns about the blogging world. Well, I don't know exactly what those issue are but I think I could pick out a few. I've actually had this "blog ticket" thang in my mind for some time, but I didn't want to write it out of frustration, or have it seem like a rebuttle to any particular post. I can go there, but this is going to be a generalized look at debates (on blogs), from my perspective.


FreeMan said...
My Man Carey,I'm in the gang fight too so sorry I came in with haymakers while everyone else was trying to stop the fight. The cat touched my shoulder after the game and I had to chin check him. LOLWhat you might calla moment of weak explanation has to be looked at through the whole post. What we had there was a Tangent gone wild where the main fight was about a man then it became about his wife.Look we got some cats who don't build but argue. These cats get a kick out of being smart. Then you have the builders who don't got time for the bull. They get a kick out of building but let's never forget they get a kick out of kicking ass too. So when they cross we get a after school fight between the Nerd and the Jock. One is crying foul because he won't put up his dukes the other knows he doesn't have to win with words because the other's frailty.Both sides have a problem and that is recognizing the other is not worth fighting with. So I blame the seriousness of the subject matter for why people fight in the first place. We want a solution but instead of figuring that out we attempt to destroy the character of the opposition.Either way did you see the knockout punch! LOL Don't be surprised just keep your head on a swivel when you start a fight!


CareyCarey said...
Now Freeman, don't bring that shit up in here, like I do at other folks blogs *lol*.I am going to take the 5th on your question about the knockout punch ...don't make me, you can't make me.I did however see that fool tap that brotha on his shoulder and turn away with a smile on his face. Well, the smile was just a frown turned upside down when ol'boy clocked his ass. I bet he won't do that again.But seriously, it's very seldom that fights end up being about the core issue. Black men and their egos are dangerous thangs. But I'll tell you what, you're from Compton - right. Big RiPPa's base is Memphis, one of the toughest cities in Amerca - right. Well, since I live in the midwest, I'll be Don King. I smell money. I see a cage match in Las Vegas *lol*.But seriously, I respect both of you guys and some serious accusations have been made. Now, I wish there was a place we could go (away from the crowds) were we could see who's talking shit and who's talking facts. So, Big RiPPa is really a white guy? ...and you blasted people about blogspace for money and then turned around sold your soul? Island people aren't really black?See, you boys have distracted me from my normal mess *lol*Can I please continue giving out blog tickets ...Damn *smirk*

FreeMan said...
This is why I usually stop because tidbits can be pulled from any of our arguments for the sake of proving a point.I'll back mine up anytime you want on back channels hit me up at freeman@riseandgrind.com. All he has is him taking one line out of context when I was explaining my point of view on Barack Obama. Now c'mon the Compton Memphis thing ain't going to happen because it ain't that serious. He is a smart guy and if you read anything I said about him he knows I say that. In fact I said to him one day he'll come over to build and I'll be willing but he doesn't want that. So when you see a nerd in bully's clothing coming you put up your dukes and bomb first.I try to steer clear of the cat because I don't know if we can have a civil conversation. But I respect what you're really trying to tell me so I'll fall back.

FreeMan said...
Also, let me clear the accusations up because they are easy to explain. .and you blasted people about blogspace for money and then turned around sold your soul? Island people aren't really black?Now think for a second about me blasting people for making money on blogs and then me making a blog talking about money. At the end of that post blasting adsense I said you might as well sell your own products because you'll make more money than trying to get a million clicks from adsense. Then ask yourself what's really up and email me. Island people aren't really black is him running with my Barack Obama post I put up a while back on the FreeMan Press. I merely said people who aren't from the US will not see things the same way we will. So he ran with that to say I don't think Island people aren't black. I used examples of me being in Flat Bush brooklyn and saying all the west Indian cats over there have a different culture. My goal was to point out dont' be surprised if Barack Obama does not share all of our ideals. Again ask yourself why would I say something like that and then email me. Now this cat does this with everyone who doesn't agree with him then runs and puts it on his blog. So like I said email me because I ain't hiding and I ain't running. I know cats want to show me as a hypocrite but as a Man I will take all the questions. I know in our community frauds are frowned upon so I know people will come here to check me. Again email me at freeman@riseandgrind.com


Mizrepresent said...
Do your thing CareyCarey...i'm sure it will be interesting...i'll tune in.


CareyCarey said...
Hi Miz,I doubt if many are ready for this. I see people have disagreements on certain issues at their own blogs and I see their own cheerleaders behind them. Then I travel over to the other blog of the person they have the disagreement with, and they too have their own cheerleaders.Well, I wondered if those individuals would be brave enough to voice their views at a neutral site.See, the fun part wouldn't be about the issues but about how they supported their case. You know, all the slippery moves we use to evade the truth. Even if it's not about evading the truth, it can be about protecting our position at all cost. Again, I don't think many people want to hear an opposing view, so to walk into a situation like that might be a little ego deflating, and that's painful.


FreeMan said...
Set it up and I'll be there!


CareyCarey said...
UTT OH! 1 BIG SMILE! My man Freeman has jacked up his slacks. How did I know he wouldn't run? Well, because like I said, I consider him a friend and I don't hang with rudy-poots.I gotta go find RiPPa!This is going to be fun. Cussing is allowed. Black men do cuss and at times it's an effective tool.I'll be back.


CareyCarey said...
Before RiPPa comes back (and I am sure he will), this debate will run as a separate post. The court will set the guidelines. No decision has been made in regard to how the "audience" will play into the mix.


RiPPa said...
Hey Carey, what's good my brother? Nice blog and yes, I like the remix. But to me, there's no point in rehashing my earlier debate with FreeMan. Truth be told, his initial presentation is all his opinion. And lets just say that he's not versed in the art of communication much less debate - you know, something you'd think he would have learned in Law School?But hey, I understand how some people hide behind computer monitors and morph into caricatures of their pathetic lives. In other words: everybody is a gangsta tough guy from Compton on the internet - it's easy to do. I love a good debate, but attempting to have one with someone as myopic as FreeMan is pointless. Why even debate with someone who thinks they have all the answers to all solutions but yet posses a narrow minded world-view.I mean he talks about "building" all the time, but I have yet to see or understand just what exactly is being built. Maybe relationships with like minded individuals, maybe? And maybe that's a good thing if in the real world one is as shallow as he is.I've been blogging "professionally" as he says for almost 5yrs now. I've seen people like him come and go year in and year out. You know, people who attempt to make a name for themselves but really have no vision or direction they take with their blogs? You know, wannabe funny Black Power cats? Basically, brothers who are limited and say the same stuff over and over again but yet refuse to get involved in the political process because in their minds we as Black people need our own every fuckin thing in America? Even our own state, maybe?Well, I'm not that type of guy. But just incase anyone has a problem understanding what I mean. They can do themselves a favor and click the following link and read just how I dissected his hubris. You can also follow the embedded link within that post to his original post and view the intellectual asswhoopin of which he was a recipient.I'm sorry, but I have no interest in pursuing an exchange with anyone short on communication skills or dare I say detached from reality who is unable to show and prove when confronted or challenged on issues. People like that are stunted when it comes to mental growth, and there is very little I can learn from them. And I'll be honest, that's why I blog.How's that for an ego?http://rippdemup.blogspot.com/2008/12/question-is-obama-black-like-you.html


FreeMan said...
LOL I always laugh because when it's time to start the debate the guy who is the expert debator decides he is above debating.I invite anyone to follow the link and see what I wrote. If you want to ask me anything I am ready to respond. Whether we agree or disagree I don't mind talking about it and explaining more in depth my point of view.I think Rippa explained who he is so reread what he said above and decide for yourself what kind of man he is and what kind of man I am.Life is full of people who regurgitate and argue while some people are quiet and proceed to build what they say. Decide for yourself which one am I and which one is Rippa!
September 12, 2009 6:40 PM

FreeMan said...
Oh and one more thing Compton is where I'm from not who I am!I learned what I needed to learn from Law School and that is how to protect what I built. Not to go out and become a hired gun to protect the money of others.Oh yeah did you notice I said what I built! I don't talk from theory I talk from experience. Keep following the blog and you'll see if what I say builds for you.

CareyCarey said...
Dang, I am torn on this whole issue. See, I never consider myself very knowledgable on all the worldly issues. I've learned to keep my mouth closed on issues I know little about. I may give an small opinion but, I love facts. So this post and this issue was about the way people support their views (argue/debate).I think we can all agree that all the tools mentioned in my post are effective. It just depends on who is listening. Just like my take on Von & RiPPa. When Von said, "everybody agrees with me", to a degree she was correct, but outside of her circle of friends, few might agree with what she was saying.Although RiPPa said he didn't want to debate any longer, he nevertheless form an argument against Freeman. And for the most part, Freeman has done the same. I have to respect RiPPa decision not to come to an open forum (headline post), he stated his reasons. As I've said, I respect both men.

RiPPa said...
Carey, I appreciate you respecting my position on this. I'm pretty sure it would have been great for your readership. But the important thing here is education and learning. FreeMan isn't open minded to the idea of learning anything new, and therein it would be a waste of time (I mean he doesn't actually break any new ground as far as teaching anyone now does he?). Besides, anyone who clicked the link I provided in my last response can see just how his mind works. Shit, isn't it telling that after I tore him apart on his own blog he never showed his face on mine? But he's a REAL MAN, right?Beyond all of that, rehashing an old argument or position from months ago just doesn't make sense.What you can do is go back to both individual posts and make a post featuring both and let your readers decide as to what makes sense.Just a thought.
September 13, 2009 1:53 PM

CareyCarey said...
BINGO! My man RiPPa, I was going to ask if I could do that. Because for the most part, boht of you have debated in the background. I am trying to fair about this and therefore I'll try my best to use this as a learning tool. See, for me it's about the thoought process before the action.

FreeMan said...
Look Man I'm trying to be quiet but if he keeps mentioning my name I'm going to have to respond.Rippa:1. I have never wrote on your blog as you came to mine and then took the article to excite your readership.2. Most of the time you are just talking about the same thing that is on the news and on any other Black blog. I'm sure Monday you have a topic that I read 300 times on other blogs. Yes it's harder to be original than decide to be a low budget pundit regurgitating what's on TV.3. Open minded is just cowardly words for he doesn't think the way I am proceeding is valid. So your choice of that phrase reflects your point of view. What is your plan for Black people? Are you just going to say Right On in the background and then make Right On magazine or do you have any solution that hasn't been said someplace else?4.I actually don't have any problem with you because we just flat out don't agree. That's alright with me because in the end how I go about my life you have no influence on and vice versa. You are executing your CON and those to lazy to investigate will be misled. 5. This whole debate is not about being tough or anything like that. For the guy who advocates being a debater you sure do like to drop words that show how much this myopic, unoriginal, wannabe thug from Compton gets under your skin. Aren't you supposed to be the cool head here? Aren't you the intellectual? Aren't you the open minded come one come all to the Great CON!LMBAO and oh yes the B is for Black bcuz that's what I am.If I'm no threat to you why engage in the first place? I never came over to your site trying to discredit you have I? I mean you just don't add up to what you say you are by the words you choose to use. Keep doing your thing as I am not going to bother you at all.We are on two different tracks in life and that's why I don't bother you at all. You want to be known for saying things and I want to be known for doing them!Here endeth the lesson! LOL

FreeMan said...
Oh Yeah Carey,Sorry this had to happen on your blog. Next time I'll just fall back completely.

CareyCarey said...
Nawl Freeman, no need to apologize. this has been interesting, really. The initial post was about debating styles, and you guys have done a fine job of illustrating a few of my points. And it's not like I haven't had a few "debates" at y'alls house. Heck, I was over at Von's house running my mouth. RiPPa has checked me at his house so I am cool. I was going to run some of the exchanges as a feature post but I don't know where the hell I would start. See, like I said, I can't take sides on the social issues of the world, because I don't know enough (don't get to involved with things I can't change) and I hate losing. But facts don't lie. Therefore, in order for me to do a post on this debate, I'd try to cut out the razor cuts. Name calling is cool, in it's right place but at times it serve little purpose. But see, you guys are on different sides of the fence and that's a good thang. Both of you are moving on ideas that serve a purpose. RiPPa is a communicator, he uncovers the mess beneath the fluff. Your appear to seek independence through capital gains. Both of you have a place at my table.RiPPa is old school, and therefore he tries to do as my mother said to do "get that ass where they do dey dirt". That is unsettling to some, but that's what he does.I'll have to see how I'd do a post on this debate, or if I'll do it at all.But if you guys keep coming back and slapping each other upside the head, am just going to throw all the shit upon the board *lol*.Nawl, that's not what I am trying to do. But damn, you boys are working me. But I am cool with that.This has been one.

Anonymous said...
Carey,Is that YOU or Tracey Morgan in this pic, lol?????????????Booth of you are hilarious is all get out!;-)c/bird


CareyCarey said...
@anonymous ....Sssuuushh,*smile*. Yes, that's me on the right. As you can see, I've been cracking jokes for quite some time. That dude next to me was from Harlem. We were down at the Mardi, in New Orleans, acting a damn fool.So tell me (anonymously *wink*) have you been over at the "other" house reading my stuff?

Anonymous said...
YES, I read your stuff all the time & post some of it on the 'other' board I am on! Love it!


Keith said...
ROFLMAO- Man you're about to open a can of worms with this one.....I generally don't get into debates in my comment section unless somebody says something really out of the park. (I have an anonymous reader that used to really get under my skin..but then I said..just play your position and defend yourself..don't go ballistic with someone you don't even know.)I love a good debate though with someone I can see and touch (and strangle...) Just kidding..There is one blog, which I won't name (You did an entire post on it's author..wink wink) in which the content is becoming so contrary to what I believe that I would love to debate some of what is said in an intelligent matter, but under the circumstances..that would be impossible..(because of my gender and race.) Nuff said there.While I love a good debate..some bloggers are so sensitive , a debate turns into blog beef..and I aint no rapper and a little too old for that, so I tend to keep it smurfy on my end..as much as possible..but I do get where you're coming from. I do.Love this post and applaud your courage man.

CareyCarey said...
Keith, you rapped it up for me. All the things you mentioned were on my mind. I remember when you blasted on your "anonymous. You handled that quite well.In reference to the blogger I featured, I felt the same way. Well, you see what happened when I knocked on her door. I just wanted to see if she was open to a different view. It turned out that she was not.I don't know if you noticed but I had to stop this post (for a day)because I had something to do. But when I came back a couple of my friends were "talking" in the comments section. Well, I thought, why not feature the guys who stepped to the plate. Then I switched gears.Ive never viewed this as a can of worms. Like I said, it could be a good lesson on effective debating. Yes, they may have disagreements, that's obvious, but what I'd hope to see was how well they support their claims. Nothing gets in my crawl more than someone making a statement and then running from the issue. To some degree, that's why I've tried to remain being a personal type blog. I can talk about myself with some honesty and facts, but the health care issues and the overseas wars are a little beyound my understanding. I mean, I have an opinion but I like to support my opinions with solid data, hence this post.I still haven't figure out how I am going to work with my boys words. Heck, after the smoke cleared, the battle field was littered with over 6000 words. Shoot, throw mine in there and we have a mess *lol*I don't employ a hit counter, so I never know if anyone is reading this, so thanks for stopping by and giving me a holler.
September 14, 2009 3:32 PM
Post a Comment

5 comments:

2cute4u said...

First time here..
I was here..
I read this post and I had fun..

Anna Renee said...

Hawt dayum! I missed this???
On Sept 11? Oh heyel nawl! I'm down for a rerun! I loves to see a good fight, as you know! Don't delete this one, please? I want to read it a few more times!!
Carey you spoke a word when you said you had a big mouth! HAAA!
Im tryna cetch up to you!

CareyCarey said...

Hello 2cute4u, that's an interest name. I mean, I was wondering if you were too cute to visit? I am just kidding. But as you can see by this post, this blog is not for the weak of heart. Well, sometimes I stir up a little mess (be quite Anna). I like for people to speak their mind and mean what they say. Thanks for stopping by. Are you still looking for Mr Right? If you are, I have a tip for you.

Now, My sister Anna Renee.

Don't be smiling now. And don't be talking about my big mouth. Some people love this mouth *lol*

So you missed this one? Well, it won't be up for long. I think I have one coming up @ 7pm or 8pm. If a person comments (new comment), I do not delete them. They just get shuffled down. But I have to agree, the comment sections are always better than the posts, imo. That's why I love for people to speak openly and honestly. If not, somebody might check that boo-boo, and/or my message wasn't clear. I don't mind a little bump & grind. Opps, that's the title of another post that might find it's way to the front. I have to do a little touch up, before I run it. It's pretty sloppy in it's present form.

2cute4u said...

Like what please? I'm itching to know. lol

CareyCarey said...

Laughing with 2cute4u. I forgot, you're the question and answer woman. I am afraid to give you any advice. I might find my remarks in your next post. I saw how you ripped the "geek" guy *lol*. You called him everything but a child of God. *smile*

I mean, the poor guy was looking for real solutions and you said he was a nerd in hiding *lol*

No No NO Nannette, you're not going to have me on your highlight reel. You'll have to sign some kind of waver, or hoath of secrecy. Or hit me off line. You're to cute for me.